Black Hole Rework, Night Stalker, and more

Discussion in 'Upcoming Changes' started by Dayne, Jul 15, 2015.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    Hi! So I figured I should create this subforum just so I can keep what the dev team is working on (or at least what I am working on) out in the open. Feel free to make any comments and concerns about balance or bugs or w/e and I'll try to listen to it. Anyways to start off, I'll discuss what I have in store for next update and why I changed it.

    Black Hole Rework:
    Really this hero, in its current state, is objectively bad for gameplay. In the goal it's just boring and stops offensive plays by just pressing q on a player. In the midfield it just 100% disrupts the flow of the game to a random result. As a striker it's just broken balance wise leading to basically free goals whenever it's off cool down.

    So, to deal with these issues, I changed a lot of things using Banjoball as a guiding source (as always). It now has a short delay (0.5 seconds) before doing anything and then after the delay slowly grows in strength (starting from very weak to basically what we have now). I also changed the direction black holes pull you so they now pull inwards instead of a normalized vector around the black hole. Finally, I lowered the blackhole itself almost entirely out of the air, leaving it just high enough to give a vertical push when near the center.

    Here's some gfys.
    This is from before I finished toying with the particles 100%
    zzz gfys don't work
    This is in its current state that I plan to release with.
    gfy

    Night Stalker:
    Ayyy new hero. Based on the Angel hero from Banjoball, Night Stalker is a mobility/striker oriented hero. This hero is basically just all of the core mechanics of Strikers but buffed. He passively moves at sprinting movespeed and toggling his sprint (Demonic Endurance) will only disable the 20% ball-slow debuff you get when maintaining the ball. It drains at double the rate of generic sprint, but he also gains back stamina at twice the default speed while you're off sprint. His Q (Empowered Kick) just kicks the ball with enough force to push it 1.25x the distance. He also has an increased turn rate (which I'm debating removing because welp).

    My current concern is that with a lack of banjo-esque goal posts and the ball speed as it is right now, he might be REALLY broken as a striker, but I have a plethora of nerfs planned if that ends up being the case. Anyways here's a gfy of his kick and icons

    Other Balance and Bugfixes:
    Io (Pull):
    • Still a bit too strong, so I'm nerfing his acceleration a bit more.
    • His model itself also gives him an edge. For one, you can't actually tell where he's facing. More importantly, he can cast spells without facing that direction, meaning he can kick a ball behind him without any turn. Because of these two reasons, I'm changing his model to Lina (not going to lie, choosing Lina specifically because of Banjoball).
    Queen of Pain (Blink):
    • Increasing blink range to 600 mostly to see if it would affect her positively. For the most part I think she's in a good place now (except for blink back particles which I REALLY should add).
    Bloodseeker (Tackle):
    • Optimized tackle code so there shouldn't be as much lag.
    Puck (Swap):
    • Increased swap projectile speed.
    • Not 100% sure but I think the animation for swap might be fixed. That or its just not laggy in single player.
     
    Last edited: Jul 15, 2015
    • Like Like x 3
  2. 13ad7uck. FullofMana Banjoballer

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    98
    Ratings:
    +11 / 2 / -5
    use ember spirit or storm spirit instead of queen of pain. both have 'remnants' that act best in capturing what banjo had in terms of effects
     
  3. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    Eh no real reason to capture banjo's effect there in terms of visuals. Wisp is a diff matter, but I don't think changing qop is super necessary
     
  4. Sir Curveshot when? Banjoballer Zealot Hockey

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    71
    Ratings:
    +23 / 23 / -6
    Change the model back to wisp. The vast majority of players don't care at all about those things and it looks way better. And everyone can kick the ball behind themselves. The model thing is a small annoyance but whatever. Just consider it a feature of the class. Also I don't agree that it needed to be nerfed any more but I don't care.
     
  5. MrRektion loldeg supreme Banjoballer

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2015
    Messages:
    68
    Ratings:
    +33 / 12 / -3
    I disagree sir, I find it very annoying both when against and playing as the wisp. It shouldn't be a "feature" when it's an unintentional side effect of a model. That's like saying butt-steals were a feature in banjo when 99% of you complained about that.
     
  6. Anti-God New Member Banjoballer

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2015
    Messages:
    9
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0
    Is it just me or is it against the original mechanics of a BH to have it affect yourself?
    EDIT: As has been suggested before, is it possible to have the NS effects trail the ball until it comes to a rest, a goal is scored, or someone else acquires it?
     
  7. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    Oh in the gfys I have multiple enigmas, but you can't see them.

    As for the night stalker's effect, its definitely possible, I'm not sure why if it's necessary tho. Might look nicer. I'll look into it next vers.
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2015
    • Like Like x 1
  8. brad Active Member Wiki Editor

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2015
    Messages:
    121
    Ratings:
    +36 / 38 / -7
    Agreed on the NS ball effect. Either make the dissipation of the effect more gradual, or have it trail for longer. The way it stops looks really abrupt and awkward.
     
  9. Civiliznations Member Banjoballer

    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    46
    Ratings:
    +21 / 2 / -1
    Is there an ETA for the version with these changes? How many more are you going to add?
     
  10. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    I don't plan on adding any other features, so either Thursday or Friday. I want to first at least check in and see what the other devs are doing and want to fix a couple more things before I shoot this out.
     
  11. Biz Top 5 Banjoballer Club Cx

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    121
    Ratings:
    +47 / 26 / -4
    Swap.
     
  12. BioCreature S.C. Banjolona

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    7
    Ratings:
    +5 / 2 / -1
    Night Stalker (NS):
    Take out the turn rate increase (I personally think that all heroes should share the same turn rate) and then I would say that he would be balanced. He would fit into the meta as a reliable mobility hero. He should be slower than Anti-Mage (AM) and Invoker's sprints. With AM and Invoker being more risky with their sprint usage (have to wait for it to recharge), NS could remain reliable/predictable throughout the match. He would have an advantage over AM as far as longer and faster passing ability. Also his increased kicking speed would help with scoring goals though I can't see him being picked for offense in high skill matches.

    All-in-all, I can see this hero having a place in the meta and would be a good jack-of-all-trades type of hero which would be easier for beginners.

    Black hole:
    I still think this will be abused in offense. From personal experience with random new players picking Enigma, I wish that black hole wasn't even in the game due to them unintentionally messing up teammates.. :(

    Io/Wisp:
    I would say to keep the Wisp model in the game but create a special particle affect indicating which way Wisp is facing.

    Queen of Pain:
    I am not a QoP player, but I think that the shorter distance was useful for people that wanted to do QoP as goalie. I think that with a longer range on the blink it will make her more viable as a defender.

    Puck:
    Is the Swap bubble set on a timer or distance traveled? Because if you increase the speed and it is on a timer, that means that it will travel a further distance. If it is set to a specific distance traveled, then only the speed is affected.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    I think I agree with the turn rate

    Black hole won't be as abuseable as it used to be. As long as it's not literally a free goal it's an improvement, I'm going to have to fine tune numbers still.

    As for the Puck changed, I changed speed to increase speed + distance :3
     
  14. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    Doub Posting for Lina Tether gfys

    gfy1

    gfy2

    I fucked up with the first gfy.
     
  15. Anti-God New Member Banjoballer

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jul 8, 2015
    Messages:
    9
    Ratings:
    +3 / 0 / -0
    Oh, never mind, you just alt tabbed.. Lice Cap, I shall use this to create my own quality gfys...
    EDIT: Stahp having so many windows open at once.. It's starting to look like a cluttered desktop.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Roken91 New Member

    Country:
    United Kingdom
    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2015
    Messages:
    25
    Ratings:
    +5 / 0 / -0
    I think replacing io for lina is a brilliant decision on the basis it's a model you can visually see the direction of more clearly.

    I agree with your Enigma update completely.

    BioCreature's point on Night Stalker (only) is exactly how I feel about this as well.
     
  17. Canoped Future best goalie/defence. Banjoballer

    Joined:
    Jul 18, 2015
    Messages:
    11
    Ratings:
    +6 / 9 / -0
    Lina was a good choice. The longer blink may still make her viable as a goalie if you use the blink to extend. I've been testing the tackle as GK and hes ok. BH sucks in net ATM. People have been kicking through the black hole.
     
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2015
  18. BioCreature S.C. Banjolona

    Joined:
    Jul 12, 2015
    Messages:
    7
    Ratings:
    +5 / 2 / -1
    Like Canoped said, you can kick through BH and still make it into the goal. But what needs to be considered is that BH slows the ball down to make it easier to catch. At the moment, I don't see Enigma fitting into the meta.
     
  19. MrRektion loldeg supreme Banjoballer

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2015
    Messages:
    68
    Ratings:
    +33 / 12 / -3
    You win some you lose some, least he showed up to play. Give it another shot dayne, or at least make it stop another shot dayne.
     
  20. Dayne Awful Player, Worse Developer Staff Member Banjoballer Wiki Editor Club Cx

    Country:
    United States
    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2015
    Messages:
    410
    Ratings:
    +170 / 32 / -21
    Yeah I mean this version in no way means I'm done with black hole. I'll be pushing changes dealing with black hole for the next few patches. That alongside physics changes should hopefully make enigma better.
     
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page